The Lionel Multi-control 1033 is a 90 watt transformer produced from 1948 to 1956. If you fried a wire going to the track it may not be a transformer problem. Thanks in advance for any information, Mike. Also, you must have a built-in circuit breaker to prevent a short circuit from causing permanent damage to the power supply or the trains. Doug, there's definitely room for the liberal arts approach to the hobby--I have a journalism degree; how I became a computer technician was pretty much an accident. Do not connect this product to any other power supply. I have had the same problem. A Passenger consist can easily use more power than the engine. Thus an appliance with a 15-ampere plug (the usual kind with parallel blades) must draw no more than 12 amperes. converting a 2-rail freight car to 2-rail with Atlas trucks, My Triple Level Layout -FREEBIE UPDATE- 3/2/23, Successful Open House Upstate (NY) Model Railroaders, FS: Lionel MPC and modern traditional size rolling stock. But it is important to take a close look at the cars to make sure that they are a good match for your set. Ryan Kunkle is a nationally recognized professional model train expert and writer with over 25 years of experience. This works for command control layouts too, since those parked trains are still drawing some current. All power supplies will be rated for volts, amps, and watts. Traditionally, Lionel trains run on AC but there are exceptions. There are also numerous static accessories that do not operate but add visual interest to your layout, such as the #24219 girder bridge. My question is.how big of a transformer will I need to power this thing? There is no reason why your Lionel ZWs and Flyer big ones cant be used to run AC-powered trains of any vintage new or old. Like all electronic products, you want to make sure your power supplies are rated by the appropriate body for your country (UL for example). Like command control, these trains still require a constant voltage to the rails. Our transformer sizing calculator allows you to obtain the minimum single or three-phase transformer size required based on the load you need to power. As the kit grows and you start putting in turnouts (or the point switching systems) to move your train from one track to another track, you will not only need more than 1 transformer, you will. Click here to learn about the Unlimited Membership. Lionel is also introducing a new 180 watt transformer to accompany the 80 watt CW 80. This set also includes an uncoupling track section, which will disconnect cars from one another at the touch of a button, and a bumper, which keeps cars from rolling off the end of the track. Here are a few: --The Lionel Fastrack Book, by Robert Schleicher. The greatest transformer Lionel made in the postwar era was the 270 watt Lionel ZW. Mike, The size of the transformer is dictated by what you want to run, the more you run the more power you will need. Frankly, its hard to go wrong with either of these transformers, especially at todays prices. Transformer sizing for new systems The backside of a control panel can turn into a "rat's nest" of wiring very quickly. "O" Gauge is what Lionel is today, along with "O27". For a 300W set up this will cost you about 100. A starter set is the best way to start with the train hobby. The CW-80 Transformer was meant to operate on 120-volt, 60-Hertz power. The smaller of the two is # 12028, which turns your oval into this: There is also the larger 12031 plan, which has a couple extra straight track pieces included, creating this: Even better, one or more of the expansion sets can be combined to create even more interesting track layouts. It will require a minimum of 108' of track just to do a basic rectangle before I add any switches, etc. A: According to Lionel's head of customer service, on the underside of their CW80 transformers, starting in late 2009, the vendor applied a sticker that states "QC50" on it. If you continue to use this site we will assume that you are happy with it. The insulation on the outside of the wire also varies greatly. Lots of good information for building any size O Gauge layout. Thanks! This would be more than enough for any single train and a few accessories. Is there anyway of saying how much track it will power? I don't want to buy a lot more track, but then find out the transformer is too weak, if that make sense. I have a basement that offers an 18" concrete ledge that goes around theentire perimeter of the house that lends itself perfectly to a neat layout. For a classic setup of a single freight train running on a 48 (or smaller) sheet of plywood, a 90-watt Lionel 1033 or 1044 is an excellent choice. A rule of thumb from the elders, (I had to go to the mountain top for this one), Add 2 more watts for Spankybird's fun-filled layout! In the middle range, Lionel made a lot of other transformers. Max Watts on one TIU is 720W. The 1044 is just a 1033 in a different case. Adding lights to buildings, streets, and other scenic accessories usually do not require anywhere near the amperage demand of the trains themselves. Understanding Electrical Supplies and Controls. And even when Lionel trains run on AC, they sometimes do some DC trickery. Most command systems use a constant AC power supply, and trains are controlled by impulses sent through the rails. Dave: That certainly qualifies, don't forget the anti-gun lobbyist with the picket sign's. And of course, Lionel also makes lots of figures to populate your town. These systems still require a power supply but it only needs to supply a constant voltage to the rails. The Lionel RW also happens to be a great transformer for Marx or American Flyer trains too, when you connect the track leads to the B and U posts instead of the A and U posts youd normally use for most Lionel setups. no it isn't. All Lionel transformer comparisons should start here. As you progress with your layout there are a lot of people here who will help you with any questions you have. If you have the proper wire size and a properly-sized circuit breaker, you should not have any problems using the old transformer. White and black are common selections. Alternating current (AC) is the preferred power for most O Gauge three-rail trains as well as some two-rail systems in smaller scales. However, in the future if you continue in the hobby and your roster expands you may acquire motive power which requires larger curves than what came with your set. 40-200 20 Watt DC Transformer - Small DC transformer suitable for powering a single HO diesel or steam locomotive equipped with Proto-Sound 3.0. The only time you might not get your full moneys worth is during operation of locomotives equipped with Lionels TMCC or MTHs DCS command-control systems. When you block a person, they can no longer invite you to a private message or post to your profile wall. This wire is very fine and can be found in many color combinations. Our community is FREE to join. HO trains are very durable and are made with high quality parts and pieces to ensure the longevity of the Lionel train brand! Classic Toy Trains 5-Year Collection 2015-2019 DVD-ROM. The wire can also be purchased as solid or stranded. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. However, if you begin to add lighted cars, or more than a couple accessories, you may find that your train will not run as fast, or that it will shut off entirely. How do you choose the right power supply for your model trains? My question is this in order that this doesn't happen again what type of transformer would you recommend? If you have to ask,your needs are a lot more modest than that. Sign up for new product releases, promotions, and more. Multi-conductor wires with many strands of finer wire are more common for telecommunications and electronics. That was before all the technician assemby work was outsourced overseas and they left the poor engineers to fend for themselves. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. What about removing flanges from diesel wheels? I covered the more common ones, but if you have another vintage Lionel transformer of more than 75 watts and its in good condition, theres no reason not to use it. And if the power supply does fail, it is best not to repair it on your own. If youre buying a transformer, youll be able to easily find one that a professional refurbished and upgraded with the links I provide below. If you plan to just run MTH go with their DCS system if you plan to have a number of different engines or the MTH DCS Remote Commander which is limited to running only one engine at a time. If you have a starter set and have had thoughts like this, youre not alone. Classification/marker lights on the PRR steam engine, For Sale: Lionel 6-11127 Legacy Southern Pacific GS-4 Daylight, Lionel Bethlehem Steel slag car and ATLAS NYC Baggage car, Lionel O 2333790 TrainWorld & RBP Trains Chris Raines -Exclusive - Katy LEGACY ES44AC #2021, Converting MTH Rail king GS-4 PROTO 2 to ERR Cruise Commander, The Harpers Ferry Layout II - Backdrop panels completed. Here are a couple examples: As you can see, with a bit of experimentation and imagination, numerous different track layouts can be created. June 5, 2022; cleveland open chess 2021; mexican martial arts xilam An Essential Guide for Toy Train Enthusiasts! Lionel trains value varies depending on design, materials, and era. Some systems will use bluetooth technology enabling you to control the trains with your tablet or cell phone. The polarities can be reversed to change the direction of the train. Although it will not have any impact on the performance of the wire within, choosing multiple colors of wire, and standardizing on a specific color for each function, will go a long way in making your wiring easier to install and easier to detect flaws later on. In most cases, because we are dealing with relatively low voltage and amperage and in a normally stable temperature and humidity climates, our wiring does not require any extra insulation. Problem with Rail King Protocol Sounds reversing unit, My D-190 Back in Action After Move to to NC, Caboose Identification - late era vintage, Continuing Saga Newtown Hardwrare House WIP. Don't just discard your starter set pack, though. Lionel made a lot of other transformers over the years. I have noticed that my old transformers do not work well or not work at all with newer electronic whistle tenders. The Lionel motor is a collection of four electromagnetic plates with a rotating sweeper arm called a brush. The locomotives are battery-powered and made of durable plastic. Lionels HO Gauge items are back! I've got around 320 ft of track between all of the mainline, sidings, etc and I don't have any problems running my engines anywhere on the layout. This will spread the load of your lighted passenger consist across the two transformers. Join Today! The Lionel Track & Power catalog is BACK with the latest information for more ways to make your layout even bigger, better and more powerful! They are known as HO train sets because they are half the size of O-guage. For a classic setup of a single freight train running on a 48 (or smaller) sheet of plywood, a 90-wattLionel 1033 or 1044 is an excellent choice. Atlas and Bachmann have the same transformers with 80 watt outputs as well that get good reviews and would be appropriate for a smaller layout. You must be signed in to continue. (Use buss/feeder lines to distribute power.) It has FasTrack connectors on one end and O Gauge track pins on the other. My current layout uses about 28 sections of track (Lionel o-27). Over the years I have collected boxed(mostly liquor boxes) sets from attics.So I have a variety of transformers on hand. If you want a spur track to store an extra car or two, Lionel makes another expansion set [#12044] that does just that: Note that this set includes one switch which is the track section that makes the track diverge onto two separate routes. In most cases, stranded wire is preferred because the multiple threads provide more conductivity and flexibility. You should take care, however, to replace worn cords and wires. Service/Tested $55.00 1 bid $14.06 shipping 1d 6h LIONEL TYPE (KW) TRAINMASTER TRANSFORMER FOR PARTS OR RESTORATION $17.05 4 bids $19.95 shipping 9h 23m Within that range, it is generally recommended to go for the most robust power supply possible. Also, I found an old guide printed by lionel on power requirements. The first is the traditional or classic size, which are the cars that match starter sets. Great for learning all you will ever want to know about Lionels track system. Come join the discussion about brands, various scales, repairs, storage, displays, reviews, accessories, classifieds, and more! DCC decoders are one good example where the wire colors are critical. For most layouts, and most scales, Number14 stranded wire will work best for your bus. I talk more in depth about the 1033 here. The iconic and legendary 270-watt Lionel ZW was the biggest and best transformer Lionel made in the postwar era. I paid $75 + shipping for mine a year ago. Most feeders will be only a few inches long so the smaller diameter wire will not be a problem. I recently read an article/product review in the OGR magazine for the new Lioneltransformerand wassurprisedto learn that not all voltage outputwave-formsare created equal (pure sine wave versus some type of clipped sine wave). Some people even find it fun. Length of track or type of track doesn't (or shouldn't) matter. Just not quite as much. But Lionel now produces four Track Expansion Sets, which expand this basic loop into something more exciting. Three conductor wire is common for household use. What do I need to do that with? Lionel uses red and black (red always for the center rail, black for the two outer rails) as a standard in its instructions and most 3-Rail O Gauge layouts are probably wired this way. If your layout is bigger than 48, you may actually find trains run a bit better with a KW than with a smaller transformer. For a classic setup of a single freight train running on a 48 (or smaller) sheet of plywood, a 90-watt Lionel 1033 or 1044 is an excellent choice. This conserves the trains' power supply for their needs and makes troubleshooting much easier. Yes, but the train will probably run too fast, depending on the output voltage of the transformer. Can't plug into outlet? This comes primarily from the locomotive(s) but also from lights and other accessories. Price Received. (8 lights X 20 watts = 160 watts). This signifies compatibility with 50 Hertz power. A. By continuing to use this site, you indicate you accept these terms. --Heck, watching one train run is great, Ill bet TWO would be even more fun! Keep the power supplies in an area where they get plenty of air circulation to prevent overheating. We use cookies to ensure that we give you the best experience on our website. Turn on the throttle, then short the A and U posts (in the case of Lionel) or variable and base posts (in the case of Flyer) with a screwdriver or a piece of wire for a maximum of five seconds. Best bang for the buck for command are the Lionel 180W Powerhouse bricks IMO. However, if you begin adding more than 1 or 2 cars, be sure to get some extra track, or your longer train will be chasing its tail very quickly. Ryan developsmodeltrainlayouts for public andprivate display. At fifteen volts which is about as much as I can put to it without jumping the track, it pulls an average of 2.5 amps, or 37.5 watts--less than one tenth of the transformer capacity of 400. Access to this requires an OGR Forum Supporting Membership. We feature Lionel, American Flyer, MTH, Atlas O, Williams Trains, K-Line, Weaver Models, and more. Get the Classic Toy Trains newsletter delivered to your inbox twice a month, Calculating transformer size for layout size. To participate you must either login or register for an account. If your going to run anything more that what came with the set then you should probably upgrade to something a little bigger. * NOTE: We do not recommend loading a transformer above 80% of its KVA rating. They are fun to have. While most of the American Flyer products are re-issues using old Gilbert tooling from the 1950s, the O scale equipment is a combination of new designs and reissues. As the train goes by, the door to the shed opens and a figure pops out, and once the train has passed the figure re-enters the building and the door shuts. Reverse the above if planning to run mostly Lionel and go with the Lionel command system, either the full Legacy system or the upcoming CAB-1L and just add a Track Power Controller and a cable to run most MTH engines in conventional with the Lionel systems. Classic cars have a 5 or 6 as their second digit [25051, 16686, etc]. From 25 Watts to 275 Watts, a Lionel transformer could be found for every power requirment from simple circles of track to extensive railroads. If you like fixing things, fixing an old transformer is rewarding. Likewise, if you only want to run one train at a time, you can keep other trains on the track by wiring with blocks, and turning off trains that are not in use. The other type of cars are the Scale cars, which are exact or near-exact replicas of actual freight cars. Number 22 solid wire works best on most scales. --The O Gauge Railroading Primer, by Christopher Ritchie. Effort. Accessories often interact with the train, such as a crossing gate that lowers as the train passes. Its expensive, but the same factors that drove KW prices down are also driving ZW prices down. Price Received. Then the K's will do siding and switching yard duty. Lionel developed and perfected its model designs and layouts during the Pre-War Era (1901-1942). Although all Lionel cars operate on O Gauge track, the bodies of the cars are made in two slightly different sizes. A 10 amp breaker and 16 gauge wire would be appropriate for an old ZW. And of course, individual Fastrack sections are also available. Make sure you are getting the right type of power supply for your layout. ransformers were issued by Lionel thoughout the Post War period. Extending the Reach of Your Power Lionel 1033 90 Watt Multi-control Transformer (102) $9.99 1 bid $16.00 shipping 2d 9h Lionel Type Z 250 Watt Transformer & One 167 Whistle Controllers. Tech Support for the OGR Forum (NOT FOR TRAINS), PRR fellas!lets build an S2!! All members here are welcome to drop in and visit. Steve's rule of thumb for derating is very close to and in the same spirit as the NEC rule that an appliance may not draw more than 80 percent of the current rating of the outlet. Apparently there is a difference between old conventional and new conventional power. You can also run Lionel TMCC/Legacy Command Engines using the MTH DCS system with the addition of a Lionel command base and an additional cable. --I need a station for the train to stop at. This is different from the stranded wire in that the different individual wires, each with their color-coded insulation, is placed inside a secondary insulation wrap. The smallest wire you can work with will be more than sufficient. Lionel Rolling Stock Identification Guide. Lionel has a new 180 watt transformer due out soon that will be a nice upgrade. Transformer capacity is rated in KVA (kilo-volt-amperes). Make your Christmas complete with a Lionel HO Train under your. It would be advantageous if OGR magazine would put an article together comparing the major manufacturers transformers output waveform compatibility/ incompatibilitywith the various manufacturer's locomotives - Atlas O, Weaver, 3rd Rail, MTH , Lionel etc and conventional , DCS , TMCC, Legacy command control. A lot of people are using the MTH Z1000's who have smaller layouts while others have moved up to the MTH Z4000. The Lionel ZW has four sets of posts and six controls. Actually the choice of transformer is secondary to the choice of control systems since you can operate O gauge trains with most any good modern transformer. Digital command control systems (DCC) uses digital information to control the electrical power to the train. A solid and stranded wire of the same gauge will be the same total diameter. Like tankist stated.It's only running multiple engines that I run into issues. Interested in southest Pennsylvania railroads; They're controlled with a simple handheld remote control and run on easy-to-connect plastic track. They give a true 180 watts and have excellent electronic breakers. Been there, done that. It is much easier to be ready ahead of time then to have to do some changes afterwards. If youre comfortable doing some work yourself, you can buy a fixer-upper, and my informational links will tell you more about fixing one yourself. That might work, but it's probably borderline, especially if you are using something like a 1033 transformer that tops out at 16 volts. If you are wiring with a common rail for your blocks, then keeping the common rail the same color all the time while changing the color for the other rail in each block is also an option. Lionel Model Railroad and Train Transformers Lionel Model Railroad and Train Transformers Best Selling Lionel 1908080 O Gauge CW80 Transformers - Black (4) $147.85 New $110.00 Used Lionel Legacy Powermaster Lnl637146 (13) $134.99 New $90.00 Used Lionel 634120 TMCC Direct Lock-On Transformer - Silver (21) $58.99 New $49.99 Used Fortunately, there is an easy way to tell these cars apart, and the key is the numbers Lionel assigns to them. Take the hint. So, if you want to connect eight landscape lights to an electronic transformer, and the lights use 20 watts each, you would need a 160 watt transformer. Lionel Trains Pocket Price Guide 1901-2022. They are reasonably durable and were popular in their day, which means there are still a lot of them floating around so they tend to be inexpensive. It is best to use at least two different colors for your track wiring (one for each rail). "What size wire should I use?" Now, I am going to make a suggesstion that you use a larger diameter curve for your corners. Add a PW dual motor F3 (4 amps) with 5 lighted cars (another 10 bulbs - 1 amp) and you are cooking (9 amps). Today, with some luck, you can get one for closer to $100. They run on three rail track. Price Received. For more realistic operation, you need some kind of speed control (throttle) between the 10340 Automatic Reversing Unit and your transformer. Dang, this math makes my head hurt. I thought you wanted information related to your layout not operations at a trains show. As your needs grow, you can employ a larger transformer of fixed voltage. Never had a problem. There are a few standards when it comes to the color-coding. All Lionel transformer comparisons should start here. To determine the required transformer VA, multiply the secondary voltage by the required amperes: For example, VA=Volts x Amperes or 28V x 1.2 amperes = 33.6 VA. To determine the maximum transformer current, divide the transformer VA by transformer secondary voltage. Get updates and special offers via email from Trains.com brands! Get 20 articles about compact layouts and how to build them. The old transformer is not really the problem, the problem is the supply wire, particularly under heavyload (or derailment without the benefit of a quicker breaker). (using 4 of the 180 watt Lionel bricks) That's 10 amps per channel on all 4 channels. Sell Your Trains Yourself At Train Shows. The two types of cars will connect together just fine, but when side-by-side in a train, they may look a bit odd. It will require a minimum of 108' of track just to do a basic rectangle before I add any switches, etc. In some cases. You don't want to try to solder even Number 16 gauge wire right to your rails, however. A new ZW will run you in the neighborhood of $450.00 or a little less depending on your dealership. And both of them give more wattage per handle than a KW or ZW. Plug one of your transformers into each Fixed in. I justhave a very basic 027 set (guessin' mid 80's?). The 110-wattLionel RW is a cheap option, and the 125-watt LW, while a bit more expensive, gives a bit more power. Use this index to see additional details about the individual transformers issued by Lionel during the post-war period. I recently acquired a beautiful Lionel NH Alco 420. It is 5" long. www.spankybird.shutterfly.com, God bless TCA 05-58541 Benefactor Member of theNRA, Member of the American Legion, Retired Boss Hog of Roseyville , KC&D Qualified. The modern equivalent is the Lionel CW-80, but frankly I like the old ones better. Just like with your track bus and feeders, running an accessory bus of slightly heavier wire to connect to each light or accessory with a smaller feeder is a good plan. That's about enough to run a single locomotive and perhaps power a few lighted accessories or passenger cars. M3103. I am currently running about 40 bulbs, which at 0.1 A each total 4 amps! That said, if youre uncomfortable fixing a transformer, I wont look down on you for buying one someone else fixed up. Big Ed Railroad Tycoon A small set that came with track, transformer, etc. The accessory activation track (#12029) is used to activate Lionel trackside accessories. Also, you wont be able to take advantage of independent control of multiple engines on the same track without a digital controller. The 1033 is not the same as the 1044. Lest I offend, in another plane of existence I was an electronics tech. Daniel Defense firearms, parts and accessories, http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=9670, http://www.modeltrainforum.com/album.php?u=2334, 14X16 Switching style [url]http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=8241, https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCkMHvbckuBLo3pJN1FGE1Gg. Most recommend the TPCs over the powermasters The CW 80 will work to begin with. When you get DCS, keep the blocks and run the 2 sets off 2 Fixed channels out. Actually it was a train show with varied trains of all different eras being run I have mostly MTH trains though and they wouldn't run because the transformer that was running wasn't powerful enough to cycle through my MTH trainsounds. 10 Easy Ways to Improve a Christmas Train Display, Wiring a Model Railroad for Block Operation, How to Build and Wire Reverse Loops for Model Trains, How to Choose the Right Transformer for Your Model Trains, Compatibility of Different Model Train Brands, HO Scale Track Plans for Model Train Layouts, buildings, streets, and other scenic accessories. its the amount of engines you need to worry about, I'm currently running my entire layout on a single DC power supply that came with an Athearn engine/track set. Get DIY project ideas and easy-to-follow crafts to help you spruce up your space. This means that you will have about.5 volt drop if your train draws 5 amperes. It can be a great secondary power supply for lighted buildings, signals, and other accessories. Wire gauges are coded by their size. If the voltage drop in the track is more than a small fraction of the transformer voltage, that is, a volt or two, you are going to have trouble running the trains anyway. Its a bargain at that price. Good choices are the Lionel 32923 Accessory Transformer, or another 80-watt transformer like the one included in your set, #14198. Again, an independent power supply and distribution bus is a good idea for your switches. Make sure you are getting the right type of power supply for your layout. Finally, you'll never receive email notifications about content they create or likes they designate for your content. --I wish I had some more cars to put behind the engine. But a 12-gauge solid wire is one strand, while a 12-gauge stranded wire may be made up of more than a dozen much smaller individual strands spun together. Lionel Postwar 1033 Transformer Watch on If you add a lot of track and find that your train slows down as it gets farther from your transformer, you will need to run jumper wires to the opposite side of your track layout. I know my train club had an issue with conventional locomotives not running properly on a layout with DCS and TMCC and apparently solved it by replacing a Lionel transformer with an MRC transformer that puts out a pure sine wave. If your track joints aren't near perfect or if you should want to split that loop into two blocks, you'll double the voltage drop. On the flip side, the new transformers do not seem to work as well with the prewar whistle tenders.Has anyone else noticed this anomaly? Serious or fatal injuries may result. Lionel Ready-to-Play is a large sized train that's made to be affordable and easy-to-use for both kids and adults alike. Price Received. With multiple switches, lights, power supplies and more all concentrated in a small space, color coding and neatness pay off. The larger wire is usually more expensive and more challenging to work with. (10 lights X . JavaScript is disabled. The iconic and legendary 270-wattLionel ZW was the biggest and best transformer Lionel made in the postwar era. Wow.thanks for all the advice so far, guys!! The typ miniature incandecents we use average about 100 ma of current each. The Lionel 1033 is a great choice for small or medium-sized layouts. Classic Toy Trains magazine offers information about toy trains operating and collecting, toy train product news and reviews, toy train layout tips, toy train layout designs and track plans, and more. is always one of the first questions asked when someone starts to build a model railroad. Sell Your Trains To A Train Dealer or a Single Buyer. If you found this post informative or helpful, please share it! Understanding the difference is important in getting the right power supply for your needs. This type of transformer is cheap, its reliable, and its easy to find. All of the transformers that have more than 90 Watts are in great demand today as more collectors are operating retro-layouts. Transformers are sized by determining the total load required (in amps). I got a lot of lightweight transformers that came with starter sets over the years.